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Akhenaten & Nefertiti Relations Question...

 
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freeTinker
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:01 am    Post subject: Akhenaten & Nefertiti Relations Question... Reply with quote

A quick question about the Akhenaten and Nefertiti relationship. Is there any evidence to suggest they could actually have been twins? Not in the Tefnut and Shu personified sense, but in reality?

Is there anything in the ongoing DNA studies etc. that would preclude this, no matter how unlikely?

Thx
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kylejustin
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

since we don't have either mummy there is no DNA evidence to support your question.

so with no biological evidence, you must turn to archeological evidence. and there really is none concerning nefertiti's parentage. she had a sister called mutbenret, who may have married horemheb. but nowhere does nefertiti use royal titles that aren't related to akhenaten.....and certainly none referring to her being royal.
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karnsculpture
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you go by the DNA findings, Nefertiti can't be Akhenaten's twin, due to the DNA findings from the two foetuses in Tut's tomb. This is because they have DNA from outside the mummies examined, from their mother Ankhesenamun's side i.e. Nefertiti.

Of course it's possible that the foetuses were born from another, unknown wife of Tut's, but given the DNA information as well as inscriptional evidence that never shows Nefertiti as a King's daughter, and with a sister who is (discount the possibility of Aye) not a King's daughter, it is most likely that Nefertiti and Akhenaten are not brother and sister, let alone twins.

I do believe it's possible they were cousins, if Nefertiti is a daughter of Aye and if he was a brother of Tiye/son of Yuya, but there's no way that can be proven with existing evidence.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hello1 I also have a question, that I thought would be better asked on this thread rather than creating a new one... Smile

Is it at all possible that Neferteti had more than six children, but she either suffered a miscarriage, still birth or just died at an early age Idea Idea Idea
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It is of course the hieght of irony that, after this intensive campaign to expunge them from the annals of Egypt, the Amarna pharaohs are today probably the most recognized of all the country's ancient rulers!

Quote 'Amarna Sunset' by Aidan Dodson.
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Meretseger
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perfectly possible, even probable, but there is no positive evidence for it unless the infant in Meketaten's mourning reliefs is Nefertiti's.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meretseger wrote:
Perfectly possible, even probable, but there is no positive evidence for it unless the infant in Meketaten's mourning reliefs is Nefertiti's.


Thankyou, are you able to send me a source for the mourning reliefs pleeease Very Happy ?
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It is of course the hieght of irony that, after this intensive campaign to expunge them from the annals of Egypt, the Amarna pharaohs are today probably the most recognized of all the country's ancient rulers!

Quote 'Amarna Sunset' by Aidan Dodson.
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Meretseger
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It isn't in 'Amarna Sunset'? I'm not much for online sources I'm afraid most of what I know about AE comes from books - and is a bit outdated at that!
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Ikon
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Armarna Sunset" page 22 Fig 16 and 17. And in many other books etc etc...
However, here the baby is thought to represent a symbolic re-birth of Meketaten. About other children, well, there must have been because there is not a single named representation of any princes, though we know there was at least one, Tutankhamun, and I personally suspect the unknown prince is KV35 was another, until DNA shows different, or not...
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2012 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EgyptianRose wrote:
Meretseger wrote:
Perfectly possible, even probable, but there is no positive evidence for it unless the infant in Meketaten's mourning reliefs is Nefertiti's.


Thankyou, are you able to send me a source for the mourning reliefs pleeease Very Happy ?


Not really a source, but these are some of the best photographs I have seen online. They are on Thierry Benderitter's page about the tomb of Akhenaten in Amarna.

The mourning scenes are for instance #13 and 16 in the slide show towards the bottom of the page:
Akhenaten's tomb on Osirisnet
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Thieuke
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No crownprince was ever listed during Achnaton's reign. A son by Nefertite would have certainly gotten that distinction.
That leads to the conclusion Nefertiti had no living sons by her husband, but leaves open to option of dead-born or miscarried sons.

Nefertiti assuming she was the mother of the foetusses' mother must have been a female relation of Tiye's mother Thuya.
She never claimed to be the daughter of a Pharaoh so it's most likely she wasn't one.

Aye's wife Tey had a role in the upbringing of the girl. I've always considered the option that Nefertiti was the daughter of Tiye's brother Aanen who in order to have his great-granddaughters have his mother's mDNA must have married a female relative of his mother.

Aye may have been a maternal uncle of Nefertiti as well as a cousin of Tiye and Aanen. That would explain the absense of her parentage as both died before she married the crownprince.

It would also explain Aye's absence in Yuya and Thuya's tomb. It seems strange that their son would not be present when their daughter and even granddaughter Sitamun were present with gifts and dedications.
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