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Nefertiti Smiting Scene

 
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anneke
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2012 12:57 pm    Post subject: Nefertiti Smiting Scene Reply with quote

At the Boston Museum of Fine arts there is a famous scene depiciting Nefertiti smiting a female prisoner. Here is a picture from wikimedia commons

The display actually shows two talatats. This one with Nefertiti, but there is another one that fits to the bottom left which shows another boat with another smiting scene. You can only see the legs of the person smiting and but the prisoner is visible. It's only one person and not several as we see in the scenes by for instance Ramesses II. I thought is might even be a female prisoner, but I am not entirely sure of that.

Was this a "his and hers" smiting scene?

Are there any other smiting scenes that take place on boats? I thought most of them were shown to take place in temples?
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kylejustin
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the smiting scene on a boat is ringing bells, but i don't remember why. i would think nefertiti would be shown doing anything akhenaten was, so whether he was on one side of a pylon for instance and her on the other i don't know.
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is the scene I meant



There is another scene from Thebes showing Nefertiti smiting enemies.
I realized this was discussed a while ago:
http://forum.egyptiandreams.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3516

Rozette had found the image of the other smiting scene.

So these must be separate scenes as one takes place on a boat and the other in a building.

The other scene (mentioned in our older discussion) seems to show Nefertiti several times? and even as a sphinx. Too bad we cannot see the top half of the other smiting person. Would be interesting to see if it's Akhenaten or another image of Nefertiti.
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Rozette
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a representation of Akhenaten smiting an enemy in the Metropolitan Museum of Art .
See link :
http://www.metmuseum.org/Collections/search-the-collections/100001003

He is accompanied by the queen and a princess.

Hallo Anneke,

Mijn beste wensen voor het Nieuwe Jaar!

Rozette Wink
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anneke
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rozette wrote:


Hallo Anneke,

Mijn beste wensen voor het Nieuwe Jaar!

Rozette Wink


Jij ook Rozette! "so far so good" Wink
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anneke
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was looking at the scene again and I started to wonder if the structure we see could be a cabin on the deck of the ship? I wonder if it's part of the decoration of the ship? (instead of a scene taking place on the ship)

That made me wonder, just what kind of ship is this? Is this part of the Egyptian fleet? Is this a type of war ship, or is it a more personal ship to be used by the queen? If it's a war ship, then the war scenes certainly make sense.

Which lead me to another question: have any remains of these Egyptian ships been found? There is reference to ships in the Egyptian Fleet. I remember reading about a ship with a name dedicated to Amenhotep III for instance.

Which leads to another question: how many artifacts are still at the bottom of the Nile river? Would that be where we expect to find remains of such ships. Come to think of it, it may just be the case that they took the ships apart and reused parts?
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Meretseger
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The small figure of the queen, smaller even then the rowers, has always lead me to assume that the smiting scene is a decoration on the fo'csle of the Queen's barge rather than Nefertiti being depicted smiting on a barge - if you follow me. The heads on the ends of the stern paddles show that Nefer's image was all over her barge.
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dashotep
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Nefertiti smiting scene appears to be a decoration on the boat.
I don't think it would be on an actual cabin, but some Egyptian ships had platforms with bulwarks, and sometimes canopies, fore and aft...





The only other 'his and hers' smiting scenes I'm aware of are on Nubian temple facades. There is one featuring Queen Amanitore in Meroe....

But the poor recipients of the smiting appear to be male in that case...

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SidneyF
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nefertiti was shown in kingly poses because she was the co-regent of Akhenaten and even is carved wearing a kingly crown on one stela. Manetho wrote that there were three kings named "Acencheres" and the first was a woman and a king's daughter. So Nefertiti became Ankhetkheperure I. This is my opinion. Exactly why Akhenaten made his wife a co-regent I cannot say. Perhaps because he was ill and needed to protect the interests of an infant son. We'll probably never know why--but the scenes remain to tell the tale.
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SidneyF
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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SidneyF
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are the signs of a coregent--and one that is meant to be temporary. A permanent prenomen does not contain the name of another king. These say "Ankhkheperure beloved of Neferkheperure" and "Ankhkheperure beloved of Waenre".

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SidneyF
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, this is Carter's rendering of the names on a box found in Tut's tomb.




The Chief Wife is now Meritaten.
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