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The negative confessions and the 10 commandments
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:24 pm    Post subject: The negative confessions and the 10 commandments Reply with quote

Is it true that Moses got the idea for the 10 commandments from the Egyptian negative confessions?
It seems there are some confessions that correspond with the commandments-like the ones about not stealing, commiting adultery and not killing.
The difference is that there were 10 commandments, and there were 42 negative confessions. (Which explains why 42 is the answer to life, the universe and everything. Laughing Wink )
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Raia
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think that Moses created the ten commandments himself, I thought he received them from God...but then again I'm not a theologist.

I didn't know that 42 is the answer to so many things Smile
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 42 thing's a quote from Hitchhikers guide to the Galaxy, I think, but I can't remember...

I'm a bit agnostic so please don't be offended by my posts lol-I saw this on a website/book about Egypt and it claims that Christianity has a lot of influences from Egypt.
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've seen so many books as well claiming that Christianity has influence from Egypt

No offense taken Very Happy
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm sure that there has been some influences from Egypt. I'm open minded so I'm not offended by such claims. There are things like Isis and Horus being the original madonna and child, and the Jesus story being influenced by Osiris. (I actually dreamt about that once-it was a really surreal, some might say slightly blasphemous dream about God and Jesus having an argument with Osiris and Isis... Laughing )
I actually saw a book claiming that King Tut was Jesus. Now that's a far out theory...
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree, there are many different theories.

Quote:
I actually saw a book claiming that King Tut was Jesus. Now that's a far out theory...


As for that one, that's the wierdest I've ever heard!
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't deny an Egyptian influence on Jewish-Hebrew lore and religion, but "caution" is always a valuable thing. Most religions and philosophies have a common ground, being human morality. This is best described with the theory of "the golden rule". The rule goes: "you will not do unto others what u don't wish to be done to yourself". Probably sounding very familiar. Smile

That basic rule returns in most to every religious system, since it's based upon the "simple" fact of human ethics and morality. To go short, it's not coincidental that religions share the same rules or commandments or advices, but it's not always because of a mutual influence as well. It's mostly because of the fact that we're all humans who don't wish to be harmed. So we simply forbid or frown upon any form of harming people. Not that this is always followed though. Wink
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There seems to be a generally accepted view that the law of Moses in the Bible is based on Hammurabi's laws of Babylonia. There seem to be many exact parallels. As far as the 10 commandments go, I think it's true though that they are basically rooted in ideas of morality that all human beings would find sound. Similar ideas are found in the Tao te ching and the Analects of Confucius, where there could be no possibility of influence.

To pass to other matters, there's certainly no doubt that Graeco-Roman images of Isis and Horus influenced Christian depictions of the MAdonna and Child. It's also true that there are parallels between the death and resurrection of Christ and other dying and rising gods like Osiris. Though it's more general similarities than exact parallels. Perhaps Jesus was trying to introduce some of the ideas of a Hellenistic mystery cult (which the worship of Isis and Osiris had become by then) to the Jews in a form which they would find acceptable. Who knows, it's difficult to say now.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i feel that all the relgions had to of came from the same place or else they wouldnt have so much in common like the Cristen faith and the egyptian faith and the greek faith.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In early medieval Scotland and Ireland, when Christianity was being introduced, we can see influences from Egypt in the illuminated manuscripts; some have Christ in the 'Osiris' pose, with crossed arms. There is also a theory that the Irish high crosses partly came from the shape of the ankh. Not everyone subscribes to that idea though.
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have heard of that...the Lindisfarne gospels apparently have Coptic influences. I have never heard of Christ in the Osiris pose. Does that mean the Egyptians travelled to Britain that far back???
I have heard that the general cross has been influenced by the ankh.

Also, if you look at the stories of Mary and Jesus they have their similarities in the Isis and Osiris myths:

Mary had to look for a place to stay and she was turned away before she got to the stable/manger. There is a story about Isis doing something similar-I think she had to look for somewhere to stay (not sure if this was beofre or after she gave birth) but was rejected by a rich woman. (and then Isis unleashed a load of scorpions on her!)
Osiris was betrayed by Set at a lavish meal or party, similar to Jesus being betrayed by Judas at the last supper.

And many other similarities. Given the fact that biblical figures like Moses and Jesus were in Egypt, there must have been some sort of influence.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe it's far more complex; the Hammurabi code has many laws, indications, punishments, and has, if I remember well over 300 negative rules and around 50 positive.
Here is a link who gives an idea:
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/hamcode.html

Where as the 10 commandments being inspired from Egypt, of course, Moses lived in Egypt....
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rainbow wrote:
I believe it's far more complex; the Hammurabi code has many laws, indications, punishments, and has, if I remember well over 300 negative rules and around 50 positive.
Here is a link who gives an idea:
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/ancient/hamcode.html

Where as the 10 commandments being inspired from Egypt, of course, Moses lived in Egypt....


yes, and Jesus stayed also a few yearsa in Egypt, they are remains of his passage all over Middle-Egypt.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2004 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't think it's so much Egyptians travelling to Britain as the other way around, or at least to the Continent, where they would pick up influences and ideas.

St Anthony (who was in Egypt) and the Desert Fathers were highly revered at this time (early medieval Ireland and Scotland) and many in religious orders used them as a model, going into solitude for contemplation, or going on 'peregrinatio' or voyages of spiritual discovery.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 24, 2004 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raia wrote:
I don't think that Moses created the ten commandments himself, I thought he received them from God...but then again I'm not a theologist.


my religion-teacher always told us, not to take everything for real what is said in the bible/pld testament...

of course moses created the commandments himself, but if he had told his people to ebey the rules he has made, they would probably have kicked his a** (thats what my teach said Very Happy)
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