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rome or egypt
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kmt_sesh
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've become totally addicted to Rome. I've ordered the next disk from Netflix, and I'm nearing the end of the first season. The producers of this series went above and beyond.

I thought the stuff about Cleopatra was a hoot! I'll bet that's the first time she's ever been depicted as a ditzy, ***addled party woman. I got a kick out of how Vorenus refused Cleopatra's advances but his friend Titus Pullo sure wasn't too hesitant to step up to that plate. So there's a new spin on history: Cleopatra's son and crown prince, Ptolemy Caesar, may not have been Julius Caesar's but an ordinary Roman soldier's! There's that scene at the end of the episode when Caesar is holding up his son to his troops and they're all cheering--though Pullo is cheering the loudest. Vorenus gives him that warning look of his and Pullo dials it down.

LOL Sorry, I'll stop gushing now. I could start a thread just on Rome...except this happens to be a board about ancient Egypt.

And no, that definitely wasn't tobacco in Cleopatra's pipe!
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Amazing i read this post ages ago and last night i was flicking through the channels and suddenly i see caesar talking to some boy with a black wig and some type of crown on and i immediately think he is in syria or some eastern middleastern country and then the boy gets angry at caesar for saying egypt is just a vassal of rome, the mention of the word "egypt" and immediately my attention is captured and he goes and sits down on his throne and a man is supporting his feet.

I knew it was caesar because i had watched 10 minutes of Rome a long long time ago one night and it had a lady praying and then she was drenched in blood and it also featured caesar in some other military scene then i got bored and turned it off.

Rome's timeslot must have changed cause it used to be on a different day and much earlier in the evening and now it is on later in the week and much later at night-so it was a surprise to me when i stumbled across it and such an amazing coincidence, as i discovered , i was watching the same episode you two were talking about!

I had missed the beginning of the show and came in when caesar was talking to cleopatras young husband and then i watched the episode through to the end.

Her portrayl was refreshing, and a nice twist-all the while staying realistic and i was completely captured by the episode and characters and felt like i was in AE two thousand years ago.

I liked the way, when her maid threw the pipe out, they did it in a way where you suddenly realised they were in fact moving and not stationary as i had originally thought-i wonder if such contraptions as those massive portable "palacial villas" existed?

Also the anklet cleopatra was wearing, the gold cobra coiled around her ankle like that(i think it had a head like the cobras from the old kingdom which is accurate as the greek pharoahs turned to the old kingdom for inspiration)only added to her sensual and exotic nature.

Cleopatra also looked greek, which was great because it added a huge amount of realism to the whole character.

lol i thought how her maid went out and looked at the two guys-completely confused as to who she should chose was a funny scene.

The scene where cleopatra confronts her husband was full of tension and i really liked it.

I liked how Cleopatra maintained her aura of power through out the whole episode.

The massive statue in the background in the last scene where caesar is holding his son up, you can only see it's feet and the wife in between them, showcased AE in all it's tremendous glory and i just loved it!

I wonder why though, that cleopatras husband was wearing a crown that looked more like it came from europe than egypt? I also thought it strange how none of the AE royalty wore cobras on their brows-i was really lookingforward to seeing all the elaborate headgear AE monarchs wore but the episode was completely devoid of any such extravagance.

Guess i'll just have to wait for next week to get my fix of Rome isisinacrisis and kmt_sesh-i really enjoyed it, simply because when the episode ended i found i had been completely captured by the atmosphere it had created and felt like i was actually in AE....it was nice to have that escapeism.
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kmt_sesh
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I knew it was caesar because i had watched 10 minutes of Rome a long long time ago one night...


Yes, that scene with Caesar and the young boy (Pharaoh Ptolemy XIV, Cleopatra's brother) was one of the episodes from the first season of Rome.

I remember it well because, I freely admit, I am absolutely, totally, and overwhelmingly addicted to this miniseries. I've watched the whole first season and am pulling out my hair now because I think season two hasn't even started up yet, and my cable package doesn't include HBO (on which Rome is broadcast). I'll have to wait for all of season two to finish before it comes out on DVD and I can start renting it.

For me personally, Rome is far and away the very best miniseries I've ever seen.

Anyway, I really enjoyed the episode you were talking about. The young Ptolemy XIV is the kind of arrogant and self-absorbed king you'd expect for a Macedonian pharaoh. What I wasn't expecting was the ***adled, sex-craving version of Cleopatra. I loved it!

Rome is perhaps the most carefully researched and realistis historical-based miniseries ever aired, and each episode is as much an education as it is a delight.

Very Happy
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It certainly makes a change from the Elizabeth Taylor depiction...but is it accurate? I've heard of her being a sex addict, for sure, but not a prostitute (I think that's what she was doing? I may be wrong?) and I've not heard of her being drugged up (btw, what was she smoking? That's what I'm wondering...was it wacky backy?) I've not seen anything about Cleo that says that, but then again, I know Rome (the series) isn't supposed to be accurate, but dramatic! But her pixie-like, squeaky voiced and not particularly beautiful appearance certainly made a refreshing change from the 'beautiful' Cleopatras you usually see in movies! Wink Though I agree about little Ptolemy and his 'spoilt brat' attitude, I liked that as well.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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I've heard of her being a sex addict, for sure, but not a prostitute (I think that's what she was doing? I may be wrong?)


She wasn't being a prostitute. She knew she was ovulating and she was desperate to have a child, and preferably a boy so the throne would stay in her family for at least another generation.

The really funny part is the twist the producers threw in. We are told from history that the son Cleopatra had was from Julius Caeser, which is why she named him Ptolemy Caesarion. But the miniseries leaves us with the possibility that the son actually comes from Titus Pullo (the giant of a soldier and best friend to the officer Lucius Vorenus). Pullo is one of my favorites on the miniseries.

Quote:
...and I've not heard of her being drugged up (btw, what was she smoking? That's what I'm wondering...was it wacky backy?)


That was most likely opium, which was always a popular narcotic throughout the Middle East. There was little to no stigma in enjoying opium in ancient times.

We can't know for certain how much opium (if any) Cleopatra VII may have taken in her life, but it's likely she did. It was part of Hellenistic culture. I'm sure plenty of Greek and Roman royals helped themselves to plenty of it--and it would sure help to explain some of their bizarre behavior. Razz

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...then again, I know Rome (the series) isn't supposed to be accurate, but dramatic!


But it is realistic. Remarkably so! Certainly the producers have taken poetic license (as with Pullo and Cleopatra), but they researched the times and cultures exhaustively. The dress, the religious rituals, combat equipment and tactics, important events of the time, notable actions of people like Julius Caesar, Marc Anthony, and Pomey Magnus...all are straight from the history books. They had to embellish the characters and actions of people like Atia because so little is known about them, but even in her case they used the life of a notoriously ambitious and "loose" Roman woman to help flesh her out (and for the life of me I can't recall this woman's name).

They have even done nearly all of the filming in Italy, in one of the world's largest sets, outside Rome. All of the extras you see walking the streets are Italians. They built the entire set to look like the streets of ancient Rome, and it's one of the largest ever constructed. I can't imagine what this miniseries must be costing!

All right, I've gushed enough for now. I just checked the Rome website and the new episodes (season two) start January 14. This Sunday! Oh, why don't I have HBO! cussing
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kmt_sesh
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, and another thing. I know I'm just stuck in a fantasy world, but for their next project I would love to see the producers of Rome do a miniseries about ancient Egypt. There's so much to draw from. Tuthmosis III as the main subject would be very interesting, or perhaps Ramesses II (as long as they stay away from the Exodus fable completely). They would have to do a lot more with poetic license because we really don't know anything about the personal lives of pharaohs, but I'd be glued to the TV.

And put it on some channel my cable package includes! cussing

All right, I'm done for now. No, really, I am.
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Oh, and another thing. I know I'm just stuck in a fantasy world, but for their next project I would love to see the producers of Rome do a miniseries about ancient Egypt. There's so much to draw from. Tuthmosis III as the main subject would be very interesting, or perhaps Ramesses II (as long as they stay away from the Exodus fable completely). They would have to do a lot more with poetic license because we really don't know anything about the personal lives of pharaohs, but I'd be glued to the TV.


I agree! I'd definitely be even addicted to that if they did this. Maybe even Rameses III because of the harem stuff, that would make for some fun plots. I just want to see a good non-documentary series on Egypt (or a movie) because we haven't had one since the Mummy movies!

What I meant was that most of the critics said that Rome was too gory and too kinky and that it was overkill and in adding more action they took out the accuracy-but critics are old spoilsports anyway, I never usually agree with them. Razz I agree with the realisticness of the sets though and the costumes etc. And I'm sure it was as gory and raunchy as they portray! I didn't realise they filmed it in Italy with Italian extras-I really like that. (Maybe they could do the same in Egypt if they did that miniseries of your/our dreams?)
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Maybe even Rameses III because of the harem stuff, that would make for some fun plots.


Oooo, that's a good idea. I hadn't thought of that one. They could even show the trials based on the court records that have come down to us. And it would be a treat to see Deir el Medina and Medinet Habu brought back to life!

Okay, I'm all in favor of it. Let's start a petition and get the ball rolling. Very Happy

Quote:
the critics said that Rome was too gory and too kinky and that it was overkill and in adding more action they took out the accuracy


It shows how little the critics know. The rise of Julius Caesar was a violent time in the Roman empire. There were the wars with the northern Europeans and then the civil war between Caesar and Pompey Magnus. And then there was all that nasty business that developed between Cleopatra, Marc Anthony, and Octavian (Augustus Caesar). There was gore a-plenty!

As for the kinkiness, well...that's just such fun. Twisted Evil The producers made a point of it to try to portray the much different attitudes about sex in ancient times. There were few hangups when men were with women, or men were with men, or women were with women, or when men were with prostitutes, or in many cases when men were with slave boys or slave girls (these slave children were often referred to as "pets"). Different times, all right.

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I didn't realise they filmed it in Italy with Italian extras-I really like that. (Maybe they could do the same in Egypt if they did that miniseries of your/our dreams?)


And playing the part of Ramesses III Usermaatre Meryamun: well, none other than Zahi Hawass, of course. Cool
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmt_sesh wrote:

Quote:
I didn't realise they filmed it in Italy with Italian extras-I really like that. (Maybe they could do the same in Egypt if they did that miniseries of your/our dreams?)


And playing the part of Ramesses III Usermaatre Meryamun: well, none other than Zahi Hawass, of course. Cool


I thought ZH would be more suited to Rameses II? Wink
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isisinacrisis wrote:
I thought ZH would be more suited to Rameses II?

Shocked Okay, the association between Zahi Hawass and Ramses II is making me feel somewhat ill... puke_r

I actually taped the whole series of Rome a few months ago when it was being shown on the BBC, but I haven't got around to watching any of it yet. I must admit, though, you're all making it sound very interesting. Very Happy I did originally think that I'll probably just buy the book instead, but now I might have to go and dig out the tape! pharaohthumb

I didn't know that there was going to be another series of it either...I wonder if it will be about the same characters. Idea
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

isisinacrisis wrote:

Quote:
I thought ZH would be more suited to Rameses II?


Hey, one pharaoh at a time. They'll shoot the harim-conspiracy miniseries first, and then they can do one about the greatest pharaoh of them all, Zahi Haw...er, I mean Ramesses II.

Daughter_Of_SETI wrote:
Quote:
Shocked Okay, the association between Zahi Hawass and Ramses II is making me feel somewhat ill... puke_r


What, you don't like the image of Hawass strutting around in nothing but a form-fitting linen kilt?

Oh boy, I'm in trouble now!

Okay, just forget I said that...and give yourself a smart conk on the head to erase that image. You know the one, Zahi in a tight little kilt. Okay, enough now.

Quote:
I must admit, though, you're all making it sound very interesting. I did originally think that I'll probably just buy the book instead, but now I might have to go and dig out the tape!


I didn't know there was a book. In any case, trust me, this is one of those cases where you want to see it acted out. I honestly can't think of another miniseries that compares to it.

Quote:
I didn't know that there was going to be another series of it either...I wonder if it will be about the same characters.


Yeah, the first season was just the start. It carries us through the rise and fall of Julius Caesar. Season two starts tomorrow (oh, I want HBO!) and it picks up with the aftermath, including the rise of young Octavian (soon to be Augustus Caesar).

Hopefully, then, this means we'll get to see the ***adled Cleopatra again! Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmt_sesh wrote:
What, you don't like the image of Hawass strutting around in nothing but a form-fitting linen kilt?

Err, let me think about that one...Nooooo!!!

Hmm...Now, Bob Brier, maybe! Wink Okay, I'll stop now.

Love this poor little guy -->> <<-- I may have to be pinching him off you. Very Happy
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isisinacrisis
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kmt_sesh wrote:
isisinacrisis wrote:

Quote:
I thought ZH would be more suited to Rameses II?


Hey, one pharaoh at a time. They'll shoot the harim-conspiracy miniseries first, and then they can do one about the greatest pharaoh of them all, Zahi Haw...er, I mean Ramesses II.

Daughter_Of_SETI wrote:
Quote:
Shocked Okay, the association between Zahi Hawass and Ramses II is making me feel somewhat ill... puke_r


What, you don't like the image of Hawass strutting around in nothing but a form-fitting linen kilt?

Oh boy, I'm in trouble now!

Okay, just forget I said that...and give yourself a smart conk on the head to erase that image. You know the one, Zahi in a tight little kilt. Okay, enough now.


Ewwww! Now I'll be having nightmares about him tonight! Laughing The thought of his face 'gracing' the soon to be restored Sphinx/Abu Simbel/pyramid capstone was bad enough, but this? Shocked

Quote:
Quote:
I didn't know that there was going to be another series of it either...I wonder if it will be about the same characters.


Yeah, the first season was just the start. It carries us through the rise and fall of Julius Caesar. Season two starts tomorrow (oh, I want HBO!) and it picks up with the aftermath, including the rise of young Octavian (soon to be Augustus Caesar).

Hopefully, then, this means we'll get to see the ***adled Cleopatra again! Very Happy


I'd love to see how they do the episode where she gets kicked in the asp! Very Happy

Hopefully it'll come to BBC soon (I'm surprised it hasn't already, as it's a joint BBC/HBO production).
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 5:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Ewwww! Now I'll be having nightmares about him tonight! The thought of his face 'gracing' the soon to be restored Sphinx/Abu Simbel/pyramid capstone was bad enough, but this?


I've heard about the capstone nonsense and the Sphinx, but are there also plans for Abu Simbel? Are they going to carve Zahi's face in place of Ramesses'?

Pleasant dreams, by the way. Images of a kilted Hawass shall float through your head. Twisted Evil

Quote:
I'd love to see how they do the episode where she gets kicked in the asp!


That drugged-out pharaoh-et needs a good asp kicking! I've been wondering how they're going to handle it, since it remains an open-ended question. Will she do the romanticized version and thrust a snake to her breast? Will she swallow poison, in more typical Greek fashion? Will Octavian slay her?

Only time shall tell.

Or maybe she'll die of a drug overdose. Razz
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Laughing perhaps perhaps...but here in nepal...the stupid second season hasnt even come! errr...its a great show and its interesting how they portray cleopatra although there are many conspiracies about how she died...i wonder if Rome will take somewhat of an egyptian turn and focus on marc anthony and cleo and octavian being the villain?
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