Egyptian Dreams

Orwell · Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:05 am Post subject:

Thanks Waenre, but I have a 1978 Abacus 1972 edition an no page 286. If you could point me in the direction of the Chapter it's in, I would be very grateful.

Orwell · Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:09 am Post subject:

Whoops! That's 1972 Abacus Edition.

Would be nice if you could edit here. Maybe I'll have st start doing word docs and stop posting directly. Some of my posts might make more sense if I did, I thiink - though no guarantees. Idea

Lutz · Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 7:08 am Post subject:

Orwell · Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 7:17 am Post subject:

My Abacus (1972) version as 222 pages. It's title is "Akhenaten: Pharaoh of Egypt." I assume we're talking about the same book? Was the revised version a quite expanded version?

waenre · Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 3:29 pm Post subject:

Orwell · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:14 am Post subject:

Quoted from article by Arris. H. Kramer: Enigmatic Kiya. (Thanks for pointing out article, waenre).

“The same year, however, a surprising development occurred. Based on a new and detailed “autopsy” of the goldn sarcophagus trough from KV55, it’s typology, iconography, and six inscriptions, Grimm concluded that the sarcophagus was originally made for Akhenaten rather than Kiya, and that it was used, after becoming obsolete for religious reasons, for Smenkhkare. He found no reason to presume that the uraeus and royal beard on the sarcophagus are secondary, and pointed out that the several so-called alterations in the gold foil are optical illusions. The special form of the “Nubian wig” that appears on the sarcophagus does not point to a female per se, but is attested for Ahkhenaten. And the female speaking in the text at the foot-end is, by analogy with other coffins, not a female coffin owner, but the wife of the coffin owner (the dead king), speaking to him in her role as Isis, wife of Osiris. In the five other inscriptions, Akhenaten’s epithets occur in the form in which they also occur in Kiya’s vases.

If these conclusions are correct, we now

have Akhenaten's sarcophagus in KV55, along with his magic bricks.

Does the above quote suggest Kiya 'made' the sarcophagus for Akhenaten? That would make her alive at the time of Akhenaten's death, wouldn't it?

The only problem we have - if we like the KV55 mummy as Akhenaten theory - is the suggestion Smenkhkare is the mummy. This idea exists because "Smenkhkare" is inscribed somewhere, and the body at death was only about twenty years old. This age business is questioned by Hawass and some of his compadres. Are we so sure Hawass is so wrong?

It seems that the experts who have the most recent direct access to the tombs and mummies etecetera are the ones who are getting things wrong. What if they're not, though?

If it is Akhenaten, what is the significance of having "Smenkhkare" on the sarcophagus? Even if the sarcophagus was not used by Akhenaten for "religious porposes", why would anyone throw some other Pharaoh's body in there? Bit disrespectful for Smekhkare wouldn't it be? Smenkhkare got his burial but not his own sarcophagus? Were the Egyptian Nobility so impoverished when he died that they could not rustle up a half decent sarcophagus? Tutabkhamen got a fair send off as far as his tomb indicates.

Maybe Smekhkare was another name for Akhenaten or something???

kylejustin · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 9:53 am Post subject:

smenkhkare was not akhenaten. and i have not heard of the coffin being made for akhenaten. and i'm sure the texts have kiya's name somewhere, as her title is used.

i get the impression the burials goods for tut were either spares, from previous burials, or actually taken from the amarna burials when they were moved.
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Orwell · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:17 am Post subject:

Maybe Smenkhkare was another name for Kiya? Grimm in quoted article suggests she was performing the role of Isis at his burial - or does he? His conclusions lead me to think so anyhow. Smile

Orwell · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:22 am Post subject:

Sorry, Kyle. Should read "Grimm in quoted article suggests she was performing the role of Isis at his (Akhenaten's) burial...." Sorry for the ambiguity.

As to removal of grave goods from Amarna to KV55. Why bother? I'm a cop, and motive is always of interest to me.

Lutz · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:27 am Post subject:

Orwell · Posted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 10:44 am Post subject:

Lutz I don't think me looking at Das Geheimnis des goldenen Sarges - Echnaton und das Ende der Amarnazeit will help much. You know, because of the decided lack of German I mentioned somewhere. Laughing

Is the point you make, Grimm's yet another 'expert' who has it wrong?

Orwell · Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 3:59 am Post subject:

Are both Kiya and Nefer-ti-itti attested to by grave goods? Is either of them actually named?

Meretseger · Priest Joined: 02 Jan 2010 Posts: 588

We have fragments of an ushabati belonging to Nefertiti and the canopic jars found in KV55 are attributed to Kiya on complicated epigraphical grounds, like the coffin.