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Family from Akhmin
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anneke
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2004 8:38 pm    Post subject: Family from Akhmin Reply with quote

I have long been interested in this family from Akhmin:

Yey and Tey had at least 2 children:
Mutemwiya (married to Thutmosis IV)
Yuya (married to Tuya who may have been a dau. or grand dau of Amenhotep II)

Yuya and Tuya had 3 children
Tiye(-Nefertari) (married to Amenhotep III)
Aanen
Ay (married to Tiy and Ankhesenamun)

Ay had 3 children (some with Tiy?)
Nefertiti (married Akhenaten)
Mutnofret = Benemut (married Akhenaten)
Nakhtmin (a general during the Amarna period)

Question Have they exacavated extensively in Akhmin? I do know that they have found some beautiful statues of Meritamon (dau of Nefertari and Ramses there)
Question Has anyone heard of information concerning Aanen? I think they found his tomb.
Question Tut's tomb contained gifts from Mutnofret (boat with her image), meritaten (her writing palette) and Nakhtmin (ushabti) Anything else from any of these relatives?
Question Where were Yey and Tey buried?
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Sesen
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2004 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a couple of things about Anen: He has his own tomb in Shaykh Abd al Qurna TT120.
Lyla Brock is working under the Canadian Institute in Egypt preparing to clear and record this tomb. Not sure how old this info is tho. Hope she finds out alot more about this fellow, and maybe his family.
The tomb first thought (incorrectly) to be his and his wife's KV 44 was undecorated, non royal and contained the remains of 7 unidentified individuals dating to the 18th Dynasty. It was reused in the 22nd Dynasty, by I think a couple of women, one a singer of Amun.
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anneke
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2004 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is kinda old, but I came accross some inscriptions I found interesting.

They always say Yuya, Yey etc were somewhat rare names.
But I found a family from several decades later:

Yuyu Jjw-jjw, First prophet of Osiris, etc., son of Unnufer Wnn-nfr, First prophet of Osiris, and Ty Tjj, Songstress of Osiris, with naos of Osiris and cartouche of Ramesses II, red granite, temp. Ramesses II, formerly in B. Drovetti colln., now in Louvre, A 67 [N.68].

[Another son? : Hori rwj, Prophet of Harendotes, son of Unnufer Wnn-nfr, First prophet of Osiris, lower part lost, with figure of hawk-headed Horus and cartouches of Ramesses II, temp. Ramesses II, formerly in R. de Rustafjaell colln. and at Sotheby's in 1913, now in Copenhagen, Ny Carlsberg Glyptotek, Æ.I.N. 1492.]

And maybe more info about the father of Yuyu?
Unnufer Wnn-nfr, First prophet of Amun, etc., son of Minhotep Mnw-tp and Maya Mj3, dedicated by son Amenemonet Jmn-m-jnt , Overseer of works on all monuments of Ramesses II, etc., with text mentioning Amun-Re lord of the Thrones of the Two Lands, Min-Hor in Koptos, Ptah-Sokari lord of Shetyt, etc., temp. Ramesses II, in Copenhagen, Ny Carlsberg Glyptotek, Æ.I.N. 662.


This could mean nothing, or we could have a branch of the Akhmin family surviving. Interesting to find the names of Yuyu and Ty.

Although they have moved from Mut to Osoris and Amun.
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Sesen
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is interesting.
I have read that the Yuya's name caused quite some trouble for the egyptian scribes. Foreign names were said to have often caused problems, but his was worse than usual. I would love to know what it means or if it is a nickname.
Funny isn't it that he's married to a Ty! More history repeating itself?
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No coincidence after all !!!

Found this on the web:


Anen had a son named Nakhtmin(The Priest, not to be confused with his cousin Nakhtmin the General)).

Nakhtmin and Muttuy had sons:
Minmose, Unnefer, Pennesuttawy
Minmose had son Paser II, Unnefer had son Imenemet (mother: Isis, superior of the Harem of Amen and daughter of Minmose!)

Unnefer and Isis:
Son Hori, son Unnefer, son Khaemweset
(Ruma is sister of Isis)

Relatives of Imenemet, son of Unnefer, son of Nakhtmin, son of Anen??
(1) Head of the Medjai, Supervisor of the works in the temple of its Majesty, Imeneminet.
(2) First Prophet of Amón, Unennefer, father of the Head of the Arc, Imeneminet.
(3) Supervisor of the works, First Prophet of Onuris, Hori, older brother of Imeneminet.
(4) Great between the Videntes ( title of the priesthood of Ra in Heliópolis) in the Temple of Ra, Chamberlain (the one who is in the house) of the Gentleman of Two Earth, Imememipet, brother of Imeneminet.
(5) Son of the King (Viceroy) of Kush, Paser, brother of the Head of the Arc [ Imeneminet ]
(6) First Prophet of Min and Isis, Minmose, brother of its Unennefer father.
(7) Head of the Arc of Kush, Pennesuttawy, brother of its father.
(Cool Escriba of divine Libro in the Temple of Amón, Jaemwaset, its brother.
(9) Priest of Min and Isis, Ruma, brother of its mother.
(10) His mother, Superiora of the Harem of Amón, Isis,/
(11) His sister, of [ same ] mother,//// [ wife ] of the Supervisor of the Temple of Amón.
(12) the nobleman of the Royal House/[ sister ] of the same mother.
(13) His sister, of the same mother, [ Henut-]Mehit, wife of the Supervisor of the Temple of Ptah.
(14) Its sister, of the same mother, ////. [ wife ] of the Head of the Arc of the cavalries.



WIves:
(i) Sacerdote-sem of the Temple of Sokar, Minmose, father of the wife of Imeneminet.
(ii) Auriga of its Majesty, Imeneminet, brother of his wife.
(iii) First Prophet of Montu, Hatiay, brother of his wife.
(iv) "Head of the Arc" (general?) of the expeditions, Hemu, brother of the mother of his wife. (v) Head of the troops to horse, Piay, brother of his wife.
(vi) Superior of the priests, Suner, brother of his wife.
(vii) the mother of its wife, Singer of Amón, Henut-Mehyt, wife of the priest-sem.
(viii) His wife, Singer of Amón, Uiay, daughter of the priest-sem
(IX) His wife, Singer of Amón, Nefertiry, daughter of the priest-sem
(x) the sister of its wife, of { same ] mother, [ of Hathor ], daughter of the priest-sem.
(xi) the sister of its wife, Nefertiry, wife of [ Auriga ] of its Majesty.
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

somehow "8" ")" turned into a smiley with sunglasses.
That's what you get when you don't preview. Laughing Laughing

Working the other direction (time wise) I found the following information (on a stela)

Paser, the "superior of the Harem" under Thutmosis III.
His son Ptahmery held the title "God's Father".

If this means "father-in-law" of the King. What queen was he father to? Was it Mutemwiya?

Note also that the name Paser surfaces again among the descendants of Yuya and Tuya via Taemwadsji (probable daughter of Nakhtmin, son of Anen)
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I posted more info about this family in the "evidence from Amarna" Forum.

Under the "Tuya" thread
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Yey and Tey had at least 2 children:
Mutemwiya (married to Thutmosis IV)
Yuya (married to Tuya who may have been a dau. or grand dau of Amenhotep II)

Yuya and Tuya had 3 children
Tiye(-Nefertari) (married to Amenhotep III)
Aanen
Ay (married to Tiy and Ankhesenamun)

Ay had 3 children (some with Tiy?)
Nefertiti (married Akhenaten)
Mutnofret = Benemut (married Akhenaten)
Nakhtmin (a general during the Amarna period)


I should point out that I don't believe this any more!!

This is my personal theory:

Yuya and Tuya had 3 children
Tiye(-Nefertari) (married to Amenhotep III)
Aanen (married to Huy, priestess)
Ay (married to Tiy and Ankhesenamun)

Ay and Tey had at least 1 child:
Nakhtmin (a General during the Amarna period)

Aanen and Huy had at least 3 children:
Nefertiti (married Akhenaten)
Mutnofret = Benemut (married her cousin Nakhtmin the General, and later Horemheb)
Nakhtmin (a Priest during the Amarna period, married a lady called Muttuy)
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anneke
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oops, Aanen married Yuy, not Huy Very Happy
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anneke
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sesen mentioned that Dr. Brock was excavating Aanen's tomb in Thebes.
Any results made public? I am curious to see who are mentioned in the tomb.

It's just my own silly theory, but if Nefertiti and Mutnodjemet are the daughter's of Anen and his wife Yuy, then they may just be mentioned in his tomb.

Although if that were really true, we would no doubt have heard about it by now. Very Happy
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just quickly harking back to the decendants of Anen
Quote:
(7) Head of the Arc of Kush, Pennesuttawy, brother of its father.

Do you know what the 'Arc' in the title is referring to?... is it a different rendering of 'bark' as in the Bark of Amun?
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anneke
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not sure what "Arc" means. That was a Spanish word I don't know the meaning of and neither does the google translator Sad
I had French in high school, long long time ago and I'm banking on the common linguistic features of the 2 languages to get the "jist" if the statements.

I would not be surprised if it was a military title though. I wondered if it could mean something like "archers".

There is mention throughout Egyptian history of Nubian military leaders and armies. Imenemet was mentioned as being head of the Medjay. For as far as I know these were renowned warriors.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It pops up here also
Quote:
(14) Its sister, of the same mother, ////. [ wife ] of the Head of the Arc of the cavalries

The thing I thought of when I read that, was the Arc that the Hebrews carried into battle. It (if, big if, it ever existed) was a bark styled arc.
The 'Bark of Amun' is so similar to the Hebrew version that it's bound to be the inspiration for the later Arc. I wonder if the Egyptians had a bark they carried into battle or had one stationed in the AmunRa temple at Wadi as-Subua in Nubia.
Having said that, it could just as easily be referring to Archers.
Nubians were a physically strong race of people, often waring with Egypt who used them also as mercenary soldiers and leaders in the army. Since the sons of the Nubian kings were educated (hostages?) in Egypt, they became thoroughly Egyptianised and as a result more easily controlled. Not that it lasted.
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anneke
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought that the "Barque of Amen" was a boat. I looked up a picture of a relief showing Hatshepsut before the Barque of Amen and it looks like a boat.

Tyldesley describes it as "Amen's barque, or barge, known as Userhat-Amen (Mighty of Prow is Amen), was a small-scale gilded wooden boat bearing the enclosed shrine which was used to protect the statue of the god from public gaze. When Amen, on the holy days which were also public holidays, left the privacy of the sanctuary to process through the streets of Thebes, he sailed in style concealed within the cabin of his boat-shrine which was carried, supported by wooden poles, on the shoulders of the priest."

Leads me to believe that this "bark" was something used during more peaceful times. But I don't know any more than you do. Very Happy


The Nubians are interesting. In "The Black Pharaohs" by Morkot it is explained that there were several Nubian States. Some would get combined at times. I had heard of "Wawat". They were the ones Kamose and Amose had to deal with I think.
The Medjay were the skilled warriors.
And then there were the chiefdoms of Irtjet, Satju and Yam.
It seems people don't even know exactly were these chiefdoms were located! (They have a general idea of course.)

I just find it interesting that our family from Akhmin becomes involved that far south. I wonder if they were considered able administrators, but just a bit too "eager". They couldn't get into a lot of trouble that far from court, could they. Laughing
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2004 1:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I thought that the "Barque of Amen" was a boat. I looked up a picture of a relief showing Hatshepsut before the Barque of Amen and it looks like a boat.

Yes thats quite right, I dont have a pic of the Hebrew one but the although its not a boat as such, the physical structure is similar to be noticable. By that I mean they were both carried on poles by high ranking priests, were shrines that contained a sacred item or image of the god, that sort of thing. And you're right in saying that the two seemed to have different purposes when not housed in their temples - one as a god at festival time - one off to war.

Quote:
I wonder if they were considered able administrators, but just a bit too "eager".

It's quite fascinating that our Akhmin family still show up in high positions after rather a long period of time. That must show that at least some of them were successful in their careers. The extended family would have become quite large into the 19th Dynasty.
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