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hieroglyphic of a horse????
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anneke
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PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2004 7:28 pm    Post subject: hieroglyphic of a horse???? Reply with quote

I was looking through some info from the Griffith institute.

There's a set of notes from the original excavation of Tut's tomb, and one of the drawings shows the hieroglyphics of a horse.

http://www.ashmol.ox.ac.uk//gri/carter/050ss-c050ss-2.html

This is part of the inscription of the handle of a whip (appropriate?).

When was the horse introduced into Egypt? I had never seen a hieroglyphic in the form of a horse. Is this as unusual as I think it is, or is this just showing my lack of knowledge? Cool Shocked Cool
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Segereh
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PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2004 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For those who are too lazy to click a link, here's the pic. It's quite cute actually Smile Never seen a horse-hieroglyph before, should have to look it up in Gardiner's.

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Segereh
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PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2004 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

anneke wrote:
The photograph is from the Griffith Institute and I believe may be copyrighted, hence the URL.


Crap. Sorry Confused
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Maatkare
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PostPosted: Thu May 27, 2004 8:03 pm    Post subject: Horses Reply with quote

The horse was introduced into Egypt at the time of the Hyksos during the Second Intermediate Period. Yes, it is very unusual, indeed, to find an attestation of a pharaoh appearing on horseback--or to find any Egyptian actually seated on a horse. When they did, it seems they rode them like a donkey, sitting on the rear portion of the beast instead of on the middle of the back, as people do now and have done for ages. Rolling Eyes
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Psusennes III
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to the "British Museum Dictionary of Ancient Egypt" the domestic Horse and the chariot were indeed introduced in the 2nd intermediate period.

The book also mentions that a horse skeleton excavated at Buhen may date as early as the Middle Kingdom.

Although they were mainly used with chariots, there are some new kingdom examples where there is a soldier mounted on the horse.
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Psusennes III
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2004 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've also found 4 images from a horse hieroglief in my copy of "Principes Generaux de l'écriture sacrée Egyptiènne" of Champollion, but I'm almost sure that more of them are in it when I have a closer look at it.

I've made some scans of those 4 but I'm not sure how to post them, maybe some help from somebody??
[/img]
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Aset
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 4:37 pm    Post subject: Horse Reply with quote

Hello to all!


Tut-anch-amun and his horse chariot, found and photographed in 1922, painting on a wooden box.

Hieroglyphic sign E6a (see above, right side, third column).

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anneke
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks fro showing that image.

I have seen the painting before, but I had never noticed the horse hieroglyphic before.

Nice to see the actual image instead of the copy I saw.

Is that a deer to the left of the feathers on the horse's head?
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Both in the most left vertical and upper horizontal tabel, left of the horse's head, there's the sign of something that looks like a deer. It has a weird tail though. In the horizontal line it is preceeded by the sign of three mountains and a determinative for a plural form (three stripes on top of the mountains). It is followed by the sign of a scepter. We have to read from right to left though in here, so the scepter (heqa) comes first, followed by what I would call a depiction of Seth and then followed by the mountainlands (chasoet). It's a guess, but I think it refers to the Desjret, the Western desert of which Seth is the Lord. Maybe the text states how Tut was hunting there, but I must admit hieroglyphics aren't my strongest point. Smile
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Maatkare
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:02 pm    Post subject: Hr Htriw Reply with quote

What is says there is "Xa Hr Htriw"--literally meaning "appearing on the team". In other words "in the chariot". That is how the AE's said it. Anything that looks like "horns" on the head of the horse would be plumes.
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Segereh
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Hr Htriw Reply with quote

Maatkare wrote:
What is says there is "Xa Hr Htriw"--literally meaning "appearing on the team". In other words "in the chariot". That is how the AE's said it. Anything that looks like "horns" on the head of the horse would be plumes.


I was referring to the picture of Tut on the chariot.
U're probably back to the original hand-copy in Anneke's thread?
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:07 pm    Post subject: Horse in Hieroglyph Reply with quote

Hello to all!

I found another site reffering to the horse in hieroglyphs.
htr


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anneke
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What does 'htr' mean?
I'm assuming it's not so simple that it means 'horse'? Cool
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dragonlady
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The word for the horses pulling the chariot, htr, is usually spelled out according to its sound; and the image of a horse serves as its determinative to distinguish it from a homonym, for instance, the word taxes, which is also htr. We pronounce the name htr as heter, adding e between consonants, according to Egyptologists' convention to compensate for the lack of vowels in the written language. Gardiner 3 lists htr as a pair of horses or a team, like Nebamun's horses."


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Aset
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello!


Correct transliteration is h(.)tr or Htr.
This horse is hieroglyphic symbol E6 (Gardiner's Sign List), not E6a.

Another homonym Htr (pronunced also "heter"), but with determinative means "rope", "cord".

H t r + determinative V1 (instead of horse E6). Very Happy


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