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Amarna Royal Tomb - Discussion
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anneke
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 4:06 pm    Post subject: Amarna Royal Tomb - Discussion Reply with quote

This was conorp's idea and I thought it would be fun to try.

Feel free to discuss the Amarna royal tomb.

Here are some good sources for information:

Akhenaten Royal Tomb from osirisnet excellent site maintained by Thierry Benderitter.

Amarna Royal tomb from touregypt This article is written by Jimmy Dunn.

Amarna royal tomb from Digital Egypt This shiort article comes from the University College London website.

Amarna royal tomb from the Amarna Project website. This comes from the website maintained by Barry Kemp. There is a downloadable resource guide on this page which may also be of use.

An interesting book might be:
Texts From the Amarna Period - William Murnane
I have this text, so I can help out there Smile

Interesting topics may be:
1. Decoration of the tomb. How are the scenes different from other royal tombs? What information do the inscription contain?
2. Who were ever buried in this tomb? What evidence is there?
3. What type of objects were found in the tomb and what information do they provide?
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conorp
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iv'e got to go sooon so i will post a longer post later.

I've always wondered if Aye cept the Royal Tomb under guard or if he abandoned the site all together. It seems to me the horumhub did most of the damage in amarna.

Conorp
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Gerard.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Talatates found at Hermopolis by G.Roeder were there from the time of Ramses II. The city was used as a quarry. The small Aten pylons were 7,33m high when E.Jomard saw them in 1798-9 (Bonaparte expedition).
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conorp
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What type of burial items do you think Akhetaten had in his tomb when he died. We know he had shabtis (see link below) and a Canopic jar.

Opinion?

Link:
Topic about Shabti's in the royal tomb
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Sesen
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Fitzwilliam Museum have quite a few fragments of Akhenaten's shabti also. http://www.fitzmuseum.cam.ac.uk/dept/ant/index.html
And some more pieces are now at the Petrie Museum
http://www.digitalegypt.ucl.ac.uk/amarna/royaltomb.html

One of the many things I find interesting about the royal tomb was the discovery of the 2 limestone bowls from earlier kings (Texts from the Amarna Period, W. Murnane page 94). One was inscribed for Thutmose III and mentions Hathor Lady of An but the one that intrigues me most was from Khafre (4th dynasty). Murnane calls them 'heirlooms' and I wonder if there was a store, or the royal treasury, of heirloom type goods kept and inherited by each king; or could the Khafre bowl have been a personal family item kept for 1000 odd yrs?

I just thought it quite amazing and a poignant human touch to have had and be buried with such a bowl and interesting that it should have been originally owned by one of the pyramid builders.

Does anyone know where the 2 bowls are now - in Cairo or another museum and has anyone seen any pictures of them?
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conorp
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2008 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
the one that intrigues me most was from Khafre


I had nether heard of this or seen a picture of it. I would greatly apreciate it if anybody could.
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Lutz
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sesen wrote:
... 2 limestone bowls from earlier kings (Texts from the Amarna Period, W. Murnane page 94). One was inscribed for Thutmose III and mentions Hathor Lady of An but the one that intrigues me most was from Khafre (4th dynasty). ... Does anyone know where the 2 bowls are now - in Cairo or another museum and has anyone seen any pictures of them?

The bowls were made of Diorite. They are reconstructed from fragments. Thutmosis III. : Cairo JdE 59282 ; Chafre : Cairo JdE 59456.

For description and pictures see Martin, Geoffrey T.: The royal tomb at El Amarna / 1 ; The Objects. - London: Egypt Exploration Society, 1974. - p. 95 - 96 & pl. 55 - 57.

Greetings,

Lutz
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Lutz
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin, Geoffrey T.: The royal tomb at El Amarna / 1 ; The Objects. - London: Egypt Exploration Society, 1974. - p. 95 - 96 & pl. 55 - 57 :



Greetings, Lutz.
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neseret
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

conorp wrote:
What type of burial items do you think Akhetaten had in his tomb when he died. We know he had shabtis (see link below) and a Canopic jar.

Opinion?

Link:
Topic about Shabti's in the royal tomb


Hmm. Canopic jar: no. Lid of a canopic jar, yes (Martin 1974: 33, No. 16). Fragment of the lid of the compartment of the canopic chest, yes (Martin 1974: 32, No. 10). Fragments of the canopic chest (which have been meticuously reconstructed), yes (Martin 1974: 32-33, No. 11-15; 17-22).

You can read about the reconstruction of the Akhenaten canopic chest in

Hamza, M. 1940. The alabaster canopic box of Akhenaten and the royal alabster boxes of the XVIIIth Dynasty. ASAE 40: 537-543.

As for other object in the Royal Tomb at Amarna with Akhenaten's name attached found within TA26 - Royal Wadi, Amarna:

Sarcophagus (red granite)
Pall sequins (Gold, bronze)
Canopic chest (calcite)
Lion bier (limestone)
Embalming blocks (limestone)
Shabtis (quartzite, sandstone, granite, limestone, calcite, faience)
Shabti implements (faience)
model boat (wood)
Sculptor's model (limestone)
Stela (limestone)
Statue fragments (calcite, limestone)
Uraeus head (faience)
Jar dockets (pottery)
Jewelry (gold, carnelian, turquoise, quartz, steatite, glass, faience)
Throwsticks
Knife (flint)
Textile
Various boxes and chests (calcite, faience)
Inlays (glass, faience)
Vessels (diorite, limestone, calcite, faience, pottery)
Jar sealing (mud)
Ostraca (Limestone)
Pounders (dolerite)

Source:

Reeves, N. and R. H. Wilkinson 1996. The Complete Valley of the Kings: Tombs and Treasures of Egypt's Greatest Pharaohs. London: Thames and Hudson.

In specific these items argue for the inclusion of Akhenaten's body in the Amarna Royal Tomb:

Pall sequins (Gold, bronze) -- placed within a tomb when the pall covering is placed OVER the burial shrine itself, as the sarcophagus is sealed off, as was done in the case of Tutankhamen.

Canopic chest (calcite) -- the chest was found empty, true. In 1931, Alfred Lucas analyzed the contents of the canopic jars found in KV 55, (which may be Akhenaten's or Smenkhkare's), and found them to contain human remains. For those who argue this KV55 burial is one of Akhenaten's, it is strong evidence of some human burial existing there, in addition to the body, which is why Reeves and Wilkinson argue as they do for it being Akhenaten, following Ayrton's argument.

Embalming blocks (limestone)

Jar dockets (pottery)

Jar sealing (mud)

As I understand Egyptian burial ritual, these items are NOT laced into the tomb until burial of the deceased, and are some of the last items placed within the tomb area before it is sealed (IOW, post burial ritual). The first (the embalming blocks) are placed with the body, and the last two are brought with the funeral procession, in supplying foodstuffs for the deceased.

Reference:

Martin, G. T. 1974. The Rock Tombs of El-'Amarna. Part VII. The Royal Tomb at El-'Amarna. The Objects. Archaeological Survey of Egypt. 35th Memoir. T. G. H. James. London: Egypt Exploration Society.

HTH.
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Sesen
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy Thankyou very much Lutz for posting that from Martins book.
I thought it interesting to see on the Thutmose III jar that the 'Djehuty' in name was left untouched.
Also the suggestion is mentioned that the jar may have come from one of the royal palaces after having been originally from a temple or district of Hathor Lady of An[...] it made me wonder if it may have just come directly from a temple or nomarch?
We can see from Tutankhamuns burial for instance that private persons could contribute and I'm reminded of the nome standards in his tomb, it just made me curious if some of the other items (from both the Amarna royal tomb burial/s and Tutankhamun's) were gifts from the 'religious sector'.

Liked the note that diorite vessels of that size are rare - so at least in that case he wasn't tossed cheapy, common junk for his afterlife Wink
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Lutz
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sesen wrote:
... I thought it interesting to see on the Thutmose III jar that the 'Djehuty' in name was left untouched. ...

Do you know examples were he is not ?

Greetings, Lutz.
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kylejustin
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 6:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i doubt the bowl with khafre's name is actually from that time. it' probably an offering bowl in the name of khafre toa god
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Chrismackint
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Has anyone else ever wondered why Akhenaten's tomb isn't as elaborate as the tombs of the amarna nobles?

For example Aye and Meryra have lush columned halls that really represent the height of power where as Akhenaten has nothing elaborate or awe inspiring in his tomb at all.

His tomb is just square rooms, and nothing to signify his immense power and importance or luxurious lifestyle.

To me this is very puzzling.

Quoting the amarna letters, Akhenaten commanded an amazing level of respect and awe from foreign leaders for example this quote from the amarna letters makes this very clear:

" I indeed prostrate myself at the feet of the king, my lord, my god, my Sun...7 times and 7 times, on the stomach and on the back. "

The elaborate tombs of the amarna nobles compared to Akhenaten's rather dull tomb is even more amazing when you consider the high regard and importance he saw himself as having, again i am quoting Akhenaten in his own words from the amarna letters:

"Come yourself, or send your son [now], and you will see the king at whose sight all lands live."

Does anyone know why Akhenaten didn't have a tomb equalling or surpassing the elaborately columned tombs of his nobles?

I mean he was a living god, worshipped by his people as a living god, there is no reason why one of his nobles should have a finer tomb than his in my opinion!

Personally i don't understand why he didn't have a massive tomb with multiple columned lined halls and other vast elaborately designed personal shrines and vast offering tables and associated structures?

It just doesn't live up to my expectations- what do you think of it?
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Vangu Vegro
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One possible reason might be the quality of the bedrock at the site of the tomb wouldn't allow for a more elaborate tomb.
And since the tomb was placed at such a symbolic location, digging another tomb elsewhere probably wasn't an option.
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Neteria
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is the rock all that different from the hardness and texture to be found in the North Tombs or in the South Tombs? Who has evaluated the "quality of the bedrock" at this Eastern site and made the comparisons?
My feeling goes more to the psychological atmosphere of the times: if Akhnenaten believed he was never going to die, the tomb would have to be considered merely as a place to store the family mummies until their resurrection.
Therefore, no great interest and no directives given, so the employees just followed routine procedures and provided only what custom required: a dug-out tomb.
IMO, courtiers and nobles had much more interest in building good mansions of eternity for their own mummies than a mystic unworried about his own death.
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