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Nefertiti's daughters
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Gypsy
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:10 pm    Post subject: Nefertiti's daughters Reply with quote

What happened to them? Meketaten died in child birth. What happened to the three youngest ones, Neferneferuraten-tasherit, Sotpenra, and Neferneferure?

And what of Beketaten? Is there evidence that she may have been a daughter of queen Tiye?

With the exception of Meritaten and Ankhesenamun, they all seem to have vanished so quickly. And even Meritaten and Ankhesenamun dissappear too soon. Crying or Very sad
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anneke
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meritaten married Smenkhare and ruled as Queen for a short time.Some think she may have even taken the throne as Ankh(et)kheperure Neferneferuaten, but there is no conclusive evidence for this latter theory.

Meketaten died in ca, year 13 or 14 f her father's reign.

Ankhesenpaaten of course married Tut and served as Queen for some 10 years.

Neferneferuaten-tasherit: Appears in some scenes in the tombs of the nobles. But disappears from the scene at the end of Akhenaten's reign.

Neferneferure: Funerary equipment was found in the royal wadi in Amarna. She seems to have been buried there at the end of Akhenaten's reign.

Setepenre I believe she is only really mentioned at the durbar scene. I don't think other evidence/items linked to her have been found.

Baketaten is said to be a King's daughter in huya tomb. From context her association with Tiye) has lead to the theory that she is a younger daughter of Amenhotep III and Tiye. But her father is never explicitly mentioned. I think it has been proposed that she could be a daughter of Kiya who was raised by Tiye, or the daughter of one of the royal daughters (Sitamen, Isis, Henuttaneb). But the latter is pure speculation for as far as I know.
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Gypsy
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow. So the three youngest daughters just vanished after Akhenatens reign. Could they have been victims of plague or famine?
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Gerard.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baketaton fille de Kiya ? is an article of Marc Gabolde BSEG 16 (1992 p.27-39
Meritaten becoming Neferneferuaten is in Marc Gabolde’s book D’Akhenaton à Toutankhamon”
A marriage vase involving what looks like an Amarna princess has been found in Ugarit.
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Gypsy
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Neferneferuraten may be Meritaten? Then there are only five daughters?
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anneke
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gypsy wrote:
Neferneferuraten may be Meritaten? Then there are only five daughters?

No the theory (well one of them?) is that Ankh(et)kheperure Neferneferuaten is a different person from Ankhkheperure Smenkhare.

Meritaten married Ankhkheperure Smenkhare. (Tomb of Meryre shows that). But she may have served as regent under thename of Ankhkheperure Neferneferuaten. This could have happened after Smenkhare died. Possibly because Tut was a minor and a regent was needed to run the country. Problem wih this theory is that there is no undisputed evidence for it.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Neferneferure: Funerary equipment was found in the royal wadi in Amarna. She seems to have been buried there at the end of Akhenaten's reign.


Was she burried in the royal tomb, or did she have a tomb for her self.

Also:
Quote:
Funerary equipment was found in the royal wadi

Like what?
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 2:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tomb 29 may have belonged to Princes Neferneferure. A fragment of an amphora was found with text identifying the object as belonging to the inner (burial) chamber of Neferneferure. The burial of the princess in this separate tomb may imply that she died some time after her father Akhenaten.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

anneke wrote:
tomb 29 may have belonged to Princes Neferneferure. A fragment of an amphora was found with text identifying the object as belonging to the inner (burial) chamber of Neferneferure. The burial of the princess in this separate tomb may imply that she died some time after her father Akhenaten.


Do you have any more information, i don't know what to google for.
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Gerard.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Egyptian Archeology #25 (Autumn 2004), article by M.Gabolde :
Tomb No.29 is impressive. Four corridors were cut and plastered but the burial chamber was never completed and the tomb is undecorated. The dimensions of the doorways and corridors are similar to the lateral suite on the right hand side of the royal tomb. Tomb No.29's location would suggest that it was cut for the burial of a royal wife of lesser rank, rather than for Nefertiti. Excavation of Barsanti's dump provided no specific evidence of burial but yielded a large quantity of pottery. One jar docket is clearly dated to year 1, winch must refer to Akhenaten's successor because of the title of the vintner. An udjat-eye. roughly worked, can hardly be part of a royal funerary object and was probably a workman's amulet. This evidence, together with the large number of stone pounders found in the wadi (160) and also in Barsanti's dump (40} strongly suggests that tomb No.29 was used as a storage place by the workmen engaged on tomb No.27 further down the wadi. Also from the cutting-dump of Comb No.29 are several shoulder sherds of a Canaanite amphora with post-firing decoration and a hieratic docket reading '(boiled) butter (semy) for the house of the Noble (?)[...]'.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.Gabolde in the same article wrote that if a burial occured, it was probably in tomb #28, the modern dump of which is scheduled to be investigated in the next season. If he has returned to Amarna, I have not seen any report.
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anneke
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the reference Gerard.

I cannot find the source where I got the info from.
The item with the reference to the robing room (?) of Princess Nefernefure was found in a dump in the wadi outside the tombs.
(Mentioned in Tyldesley's Nefertiti)

Dodson/Hilton state (pg156) that Neferneferure may have even been buried in the Royal tomb itself? She would have been buried in chamber alpha (Meketaten being buried in chamber gamma).

It has been pointed out that neither Nefernefure nor Setepenre appear in the mourning scene for Meketaten. They did take part in the Durbar of year 12, so they should be old enough to be included.
Question is: not enough space to include them? Or were they already dead?
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:51 am    Post subject: baseless speculation here! Reply with quote

I think there's good reason to suppose that Baketaten was a daughter of Tiye...she's almost always shown in scenes with Tiye. What was the basis for saying she was Kiya's daughter? It seems like Kiya gets tossed into the mix almost as a search and replace for the words "I don't know."
Kiya is probably my favourite figure from the era because she has so many possibilities...what we have of her indicates that she has a very rich history that just isn't there anymore or is yet to be discovered.
Also, there's not much of anything on the Ta-Sherit girls(Merytaten Tasherit and Ankhesenpaaten Tasherit),. If someone could reference me to a paper on them, that would be awesome. Once again, I've read that they were daughters of Kiya, or daughters of Akhesenpaaten and Merytaten respectively. On this one, and this is pure speculation, borne from my distaste about incestuous pedophilia that I probably shouldn't project on the past, and the fact that Ankhesenpaaten, judging from the foetuses in Tutankhamun's tomb, seemed to have difficulty carrying a child to term, I'd be inclined to attribute these children to Kiya--perhaps they were named of their betters rather than their mothers. /baseless speculation.
I reckon they should probably be counted as part of the above list because only Akhenaten could have been their father.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Princess Nefernefure was found in a dump in the wadi outside the tombs.


Again, do you have info?
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baketaten seen at Amarna mainly with Tiye makes sense if :
Akhenaten is her father, her mother is dead, she live elsewhere with Tiye. Visiting her father from time to time is an absolute need.

Regarding the "Ta-Sherit" girls it was written on Amarna walls. You will find the references in http://history.memphis.edu/murnane/Allen%20-%20Amarna%20Succession.pdf My first article published in January 2007 by Toutankhamon magazine was on this subject.
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