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Help needed on Nefertiti
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dachief
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 12:50 pm    Post subject: Help needed on Nefertiti Reply with quote

Hi,

I've been trying to find out who discovered Nefertiti's bust (now in the Berlin museum), when and where it was found. Also, if anyone can direct me to a map of where it was found, I'd be very grateful. Thanks
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Osiris II
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never heard the name of the person who actually discovered the bust, but it was the German Expedition in 1912 when the bust was found. In fact, there are quite a few people who think that the German Expedition "stole" the bust and smuggled it back to Berlin. Hawass thinks it should be returned to Egypt. (Fat chance!! It's one of the Berlin Museum's prime objects!)
As to where it was found. Go here:
http://www.amarnaproject.com/pages/model_of_the_city/index.shtml
And look for the home/workshop of the sculptor Thutmose. It, along with several other pieces, was found there. You might find the following interesting:
Ever since the discovery of the bust of Nefertiti, this beautiful limestone portrait has been regarded as one of the greatest art masterpieces in the world. It was found in the atelier of the famed ancient Egyptian sculptor Thutmose at Tel el Amarna, by the German expedition of 1912. Chief archaeologist Ludwig Borchard was so awed by its stunning beauty, that he devised a scheme to smuggle the piece out of Egypt.

Every archaeological discovery had in those days to be brought before the Egyptian Antiquities Authority for inventory and distribution between Egypt and the archaeological expedition. This committee supervised the split between the objects that stayed in Egypt and those that were allowed to leave the country. Gustave Lefébvre, then inspector of the Antiquities Inspectorate in Asyut, Middle Egypt, where Amarna is located, was responsible for the divisions of the finds and, not trained as Egyptologist, settled for a simple 50/50 division where objects made of plaster would go to the Germans. It seems that Borchardt, already aware of the value of the limestone bust of Queen Nefertiti, rushed the division negotiation, listed the figure as “bust of painted plaster of a princess of the royal family” (italics ours), and presented severely cropped photographs of the object to Lefébvre, who let the precious artifact go.
Roll your mouse over the image

The bust of Queen Nefertiti was put on exhibit in Berlin's Egyptian Museum in 1923, eleven years after its discovery. The Egyptian government has since made attempts to have the bust returned, but Germany has so far refused. Even Hitler felt in love with the non arian Egyptian lady, and announced that it would remain in Germany forever.

Nefertiti has been in Germany for nine decades. Visitors come from all over the world to admire her eternal beauty. Hopefully, in the near future, she will return to her homeland and the new Grand Egyptian Museum. Almost a century after the amazing discovery of the bust of Nefertiti, the meaning of her name still holds the promise of her return: "The Beautiful One has Come".
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anneke
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ludwig Borchardt discovered the bust in 1912. They found the bust in the workshop of the sculptor Tutmose. This house / workshop is labeled as P47 on maps of Amarna (Akhetaten)

Can't find a map rigth now, but the workshop was slightly south of the city center if I remember correctly.
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Montuhotep88
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was coverage of this very topic in the most recent issue of KMT (Vol 19 #3), actually, and I think there was a map included of the find site. http://www.kmtjournal.com/
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dachief
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you all for that, much appreciated.

Osiris II http://www.visitberlin.de/english/sightseeing/e_si_museen_nofretete.php

Apparently, she is going back
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conorp
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dachief wrote:
Thank you all for that, much appreciated.

Osiris II http://www.visitberlin.de/english/sightseeing/e_si_museen_nofretete.php

Apparently, she is going back


Thats the first i have heard of it. I mean, other than Zahi spit balling.
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Aset
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
...she will return to her homeland

Idea
Quote:
Apparently, she is going back...

Idea
Quote:
...the final return of the Egyptian Museum in 2009 to its historic location in the "Neues Museum".

The Egyptian Museum will return, not Nefertiti to Egypt Exclamation Very Happy

From Borchardt's diary (1912/13): Note on the discovery of the bust of Nefertiti on Dec. 06, 1912:


(Source: www.hieroglyphen.net)

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dachief
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I realised that after I posted Laughing
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Osiris II
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As I said above, and will say again. It will be a cold day in he** before Berlin returns Nefertiti!
It's one of the main features in the Berlin Museum. Many articles and pictures have been made of it, in fact, it has come to represent Ancient Egypt.
I understand the Berlin Museum is in talks to loan it to Egypt, but I really don't see it ever happening. They'd be too afraid Hawass wouldn't return it!
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dachief
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there a cartouche with Nef's name on it?
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A number of them, though I've having difficulty finding a legible one on the Web that's correct. The one at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nefertiti is reasonably close, but the reed-with-legs sign (Gardiner M18) should be a U33, I think.
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Montuhotep88
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh... and the initial reed (i) in the Aten's name should be first, rather than following the t, n, and sun-determinative.
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Montuhotep88
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aha! Try this.... http://books.google.com/books?id=xthQmzlqABIC&pg=PA31&lpg=PA31&dq=nefertiti+cartouche+-silver+-gold+-jewelry&source=web&ots=5EgNGgnJu0&sig=sYqH-UwcALRXqGloLqF3E6aoCP0&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=7&ct=result
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Montuhotep88
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And I still think the reed (i) is misplaced, but oh well!
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dachief
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's great, thank you!
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