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How True is this?
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Ikon
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thought had occured to me that he may have been kicked by a horse, perhaps some horrific scene which also caused his broken leg. If so, then considering his mother was probably killed by a horse, this was an ill fated family, and perhaps not very good at handling horses...

I wonder if he had been kicked in the chest, then what medical reason would there be to remove his sternum while still alive, and would AE physicians attempt such an operation. I say that as it seems he took a few days to die. It almost starts to seem if Tutankhamun is the first known traffic accident victim...
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Sothis
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ever since I have accepted that the damage to the chest was inflicted at the time of death and probably also caused it I consider the removal of sternum and part of the ribs as an attempt to clean up the mess rather than an attempt to save his life.
If you consider that at the very least the chest was caved in, possibly also the lungs or heart -which is missing BTW- punctured by one or more broken ribs, you can imagine that Tut might have been dead on the spot or very shortly after the incident. There would have been no way to save him.
The sternum could easily have become detached from the ribcage and broken into pieces and had to be removed. It was probably easier for the embalmers to restore the body`s appearance after any loose or broken bits were removed.

This scenario would fit a horse kick or another similar hard impact to the chest but would not account for broken leg plus detached kneecap plus damaged pelvis. Unless the horse was totally enraged and trampled all over him.

Or what about getting under the horse`s hooves by accident, for example by falling off a chariot at high speed? This seems to be more likely to me considering that Tut`s chariots appear to be well used than a kick of a horse out of the blue and could explain the other damage to the body as well.
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Naunacht
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sothis wrote:
Ever since I have accepted that the damage to the chest was inflicted at the time of death and probably also caused it I consider the removal of sternum and part of the ribs as an attempt to clean up the mess rather than an attempt to save his life.
If you consider that at the very least the chest was caved in, possibly also the lungs or heart -which is missing BTW- punctured by one or more broken ribs, you can imagine that Tut might have been dead on the spot or very shortly after the incident. There would have been no way to save him.
The sternum could easily have become detached from the ribcage and broken into pieces and had to be removed. It was probably easier for the embalmers to restore the body`s appearance after any loose or broken bits were removed.

This scenario would fit a horse kick or another similar hard impact to the chest but would not account for broken leg plus detached kneecap plus damaged pelvis. Unless the horse was totally enraged and trampled all over him.

Or what about getting under the horse`s hooves by accident, for example by falling off a chariot at high speed? This seems to be more likely to me considering that Tut`s chariots appear to be well used than a kick of a horse out of the blue and could explain the other damage to the body as well.


An acquaintance of mine was recently seriously injured when he slipped beneath a frightened horse in a closed space. He suffered shattered ribs, broken legs, head injuries. This by the way was a licensed race horse trainer who has worked with horses his entire life. He's alive today because of modern medicine. If he'd suffered those injuries in the preindustrial era he would have been dead. His x-rays probably looked like poor Tuts.

A fall in the midst of big game hunting or chariot racing would probably have similar results.
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Sothis
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really do feel sorry for him and I hope there will be no permanent damage.

For people like me who are not used to working with horses it seems sometimes hard to imagine what extensive injuries can be inflicted by them until one hears real life stories like this one.
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Naunacht
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sothis wrote:
I really do feel sorry for him and I hope there will be no permanent damage.

For people like me who are not used to working with horses it seems sometimes hard to imagine what extensive injuries can be inflicted by them until one hears real life stories like this one.


My daughter tells me he was up and about and insisting on feeding his horses a day after being sent home from the hospital. He's planning on racing the horse that hurt him in a week or so. Horse people are crazy and I know because I'm one of them.

Most of the time horses are perfectly safe. The problem is that when they panic, they lose the ability to even see that little human for what it is and go into prey animal flight mode. In that state a horse is perfectly capable of killing a human and when he regains his senses seem to be totally perplexed as to why his two legged best friend is on the ground bleeding profusely. You train them, you teach them to trust and respect you and you work to teach them to think instead of panic. Most of the time it works. I've been around horses since I was six. I'm in my fifties now and fortunately I've never had a horse panic on me--or at least have been able to get out of the way when one goes off.

I have no problem believing that 18th dynasty royalty was no different. Being a fearless horseman was part of the package a warrior king was supposed to aspire to. I find it rather touching that a young man with Tutankhamon's physical disabilities would may have pushed himself to excel in what these days would be called an extreme sport. He must have driven his caretakers crazy.
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Meretseger
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've often thought that myself.

Aye and Horemheb must have been torn between pride in Tutankhamon's efforts to become a proper sporting, warring, pharaoh and worry about his safety - as chariotmen themselves they'd have known ALL about the risks. IMO far from conspiring at Tut's murder they were fully invested in supporting and guiding him to become the kind of pharaoh his grandfather had been. His death was a DISASTER!!!
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herper
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The gods seem to have dealt Tutankhamen a mixed hand that had little chance of winning. Hopefully at the gates of the afterlife they let him enjoy the good life. Good afterlife?
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